A Little More Appreciation Wouldn't Hurt You.

Apocalypse_67

Join Date 01/2003

A Little More Appreciation Wouldn't Hurt You.

Think about this for a moment...
You sit in front of your PC and open your graphic program with a million ideas in your head. You then spend hours trying to transfer those ideas into a digital drawing pad. The end result is a decent, well thought out skin or wallpaper design that you want to FREELY share with people that might find it as useful as you do. And you go on to upload the file to your favorite skinning site only to find out that some arrogant idiot for some absurd reason totally unknown to you and with out even extending a 'thank you' slaps a big ol' 2 rating to your work. Aint that a B!*ch?

Lately I've been browsing thru the libraries and I have noticed how many nice and complete skins are "tagged" with well below average ratings with not one single word of comment.
C'mon people, if you can’t have at least the decency to extend a simple 'thank you' then don’t humiliate the authors with your idiotic ratings. And if you really find something bad on the work or have a valid reason for rating low, at least have the courtesy to post your reason.
I can understand a low rating on a sloppy skin or an incomplete skin, because that shows laziness on behalf of the author, but what I have seen on the past few days is totally ridiculous. That is why some times I think there should be an option when uploading a skin to choose if you want the skin to be rated or not.
So before you let your low-rating-trigger-finger do the job, think about the originality, time invested and functionality of the skin rather than your pitiful little reasons such as; 'I don’t like red' or 'I don’t like that author' or 'that skin is getting more ratings/download than mine'
Grow the hell up. We are here to support each others not to screw each others.

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Apocalypse_67

Join Date 01/2003

Sorry, I gotta disagree with that. Skinning is an ART...and looks matter more than functionality and performance.

Nope. Drawing/Painting is an art. Skining is a combination of graphic program manipulation and ideas. And looks are not going to make a skin performe better. If you have a 'pretty' skin but the buttons dont line up or dont function, then the skin is useless. It's just like having a state-of-the-art sound system that doesnt play music.

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You're going from one extreme to the other AP. Obviously, if the skin is broken to the point of being useless, it won't matter how good it looks. But what if it has common mistakes and flaws...but works well enough to use? Generally speaking, you're not going to find a professionally made skin that doesn't work at all. Same for skins that function perfectly...but look like total crap. Which is worse?

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Some countries [eg. Oz] make the 'right to vote' compulsory...you are free to vote as you wish....BUT you must vote for something/one. [that actually equates legally to having your name checked off on the roll...and your insertion of the paper in the slot...you don't actually have to make a 'mark'

I like that! I assume that it doesn't record the vote, only that you did vote, right?

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Apocalypse_67

Join Date 01/2003

Hus. I'll give you another example.
Your Bloss skin. In my oppinion I dont like the color. It doesnt appeal to me (Too dark for my taste) But the skin is great in function and performance. It doesnt slow down my system. The graphics are clean. All buttons work. Now should I rate it a 2 just because it's not 'pretty' enough for me?

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That 2 would be a subjective rating based on your personal opinion, that's the incorrect way to rate a skin. You shouldn't let your personal opinion come into play when rating a skin...just because you don't like black skins, doesn't make it a bad skin. If you say it has clean graphics, functions good and performs good...you should give it a rating based on those three things. If everyone rated this way...I doubt this thread would've been created in the first place.

Now, how much value each of those subjects hold is a different story. I think it's Graphics first, performance and functionality second. When I rate a skin, if it looks great...but doesn't work so good, it will get a 3. If it looks like crap...but works great...it will get a 2. See where I'm coming from?

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Jafo

Join Date 03/2001

+1845

A couple of points...

It's a skinner's vanity that will blame a low rating on a 'drive-by' and not an experienced and valid opinion.

Example....my most 'difficult' Litestep theme dropped in its rating a few points...so I looked out of curiosity.....it was a 5 from Frogboy, someone with a whole SWAG of experience in skinning, so, though there was no 'comment', BUT the overall rating dropped a few points it actually was a fair and equitable assessment from someone whose opinion deserves appreciation and was NOT a drive-by at all.

People shouldn't be fazed by changes in their ratings....it's a simple product of time and exposure...but if there's an accross-the-board 'drop' in their gallery it's a simple process to email an admin to check that it's not something nefarious.

I bet I know more about subjective opinion than most....as an Architect I have to deal with Planners and Heritage Architects who arm themselves with 'guidelines' to mask their pure unadulterated petty subjectivity that is readily exposed by clear examples of hypocrisy...[they did it that way but I can't?].....currently a sore point with me that will likely see me walking away from 30 years of this bullshit.

However...

The 'I don't like it' "I hate it', etc of the mouse-overs is NOT subjective in itself.....only their application may be.

If I were to choose 'I hate it'...it will NOT be for the reason I may not like the person....or it's pink and I hate pink....it'll be a considered opinion of all criteria that can affect the work as a whole...like how simplistic it is...or how 'common' or 'derived', how 'buggy'...how 'incomplete', and, obviously how 'ugly'.

The last one is 'subjective'...the others are merely 'comparative' or 'relative.

If 'simplistic' were the only attributable failing in determining a skin's 'worth', for example...then you'd expect to see Beatnik skins all at '1'...and WB skins all at '10'....but that is not how it works....and anyone who can be seen to be that stupid doesn't deserve to be rating, let alone drawing breath...

Again....this $10 per 'rating thread' getting me to the South of France and drinking copious reds is still looking good...

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NightTrainthedark

Join Date 07/2003

+255

It's a skinner's vanity that will blame a low rating on a 'drive-by' and not an experienced and valid opinion.

True, I learned that the hard way.

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Corky_O

Join Date 04/2004

I think it's Graphics first, performance and functionality second.

This would certainly apply to the average user, who looks through the library > "sees" something that looks good > downloads and installs it > uses it, and by default, tests the performance and functionality through use.

If the user then has the access level to rate, they would presumably rate it based on all the criteria combined - at least in a practical world.

For a higher access member, whose purpose might solely be to test the skin, then performance and functionality may have a higher priority during testing with the balance being looks.

Even so, the combination of these criteria would be considered and involved in the final evaluation process leading to a rating.

If anyone rating a skin uses all three of the categories mentioned - (1) Graphic quality (looks), (2) Performance, and (3) Functionality - then the resulting rating should actually reflect an accurate opinion, and would even fit with the star "mouse-over" definitions.

Put in these terms, I would say the rating system is set-up to succeed, and failure would be due to "user error".

Sorry if I sound redundant, just figuring while I type.

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I dont think so...people come here for skins that appeal to them visually...thats what it's all about. The other two are secondary.

As one who downloads what other create while being unable to skin my own, the visual is the intial draw.
But function and performance override once I have it loaded. I have several sitting in my folder that to me are visually appealing so I downloaded them. Once I ran them, they were changed out for a favorite within 5 minutes. Every couple of months, I may load one and just look at it, wishing I could fix for me. Then I unload it. If I can't use it for one reason or another it will not rate high just because it's pretty.

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A first impression is always the first consideration. If some thing doesn't catch the eye no few people will go further to try the skin out. I for one don't download or really follow up on skins that are not "easy" to look at. Now that I can vote (don't know why but I'm an apprentice now) I will be much more careful of my comments and will only vote on stuff i actually have tried out...I think.

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WOM

Join Date 01/2002

+253

If I'am looking at blinds, first it has to pass the eye ball test. If it doesn't look good, I won't download it. If I download it, it will get a rating (unless it's a mods) good or bad.

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Trendy is what generally gets the ratings, comments, and downloads. Assuming of course the skin is not horribly broken .... although, there have been a few.

And of course, trendy can apply not only to style but skinners as well ... also known as the skinning Gods, whomever they may be at any given point in time.

.

Bottom line, if you can't live with low ratings and/or little to no comments or downloads, and you don't make trendy skins or are not lucky enough to be one of the trendy skinners, you better be skinning for yourself to suit yourself or you're going to be one unhappy skinner.

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Madam GoodMorphing

Join Date 03/2002

There is one other thing that I almost hesitate to mention because I doubt it happens often. Sometimes when I open a skin to the detailed view and it seems like my browser has loaded the page kind of reloads real quick or something. The page jerks. Where I have left my cursor is sometimes near where the ratings are. When I am not thinking about it, I might click down to make the page active right when that second loading (or whatever it is) happens. The page moves and I know a few times I have accidently rated something quite low. I always go back and correct it if I think it happens. It used to be my big fear that I would delete something, but they have safeguards for that.

The problem seems to happen for me when i have a lot of background stuff running, and it isn't as bad now as it used to be though it still does happen sometimes. I wondered if it might be good to physically move the stars to the top of the window, but I think it probably isn't worth it. I haven't ever seen anyone else mention this.

So among all of the other reasons, there may also be the rare case where something is accidently rated.

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Apocalypse_67

Join Date 01/2003

That 2 would be a subjective rating based on your personal opinion, that's the incorrect way to rate a skin. You shouldn't let your personal opinion come into play when rating a skin...

Now you are just contradicting your self. First you say that how the skin looks is WAY, WAY, WAY more important than performance and functionality. I then give you an example of how a rating based more on looks doesn’t justify the purpose of the skin and now you are saying is incorrect.

The fact is (and remains) that the visual presentation is what’s going to 'catch' the eye of the viewers and all acolytes regarding the visual look of the skin should be poured on the comment box, but a rating should be awarded with an emphasis on the skin performance.
I gave the example of your skin because while I might not find it appealing in looks (to my taste) I still will rate it high because it functions as it should and performance wise, it has no flaws. And this is the entire point of this post.

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AP, as far as contradicting myself, I did not. I said you shoulnd't let personal opinion come into play...and thats true. You can't give a skin a bad rating just because you personally don't like the look of it. What if I rated your skin poorly because it didn't have a roll-up button on the left side, or some other function-related issue? You should rate skins unbiased, if you feel my skin had POORLY DONE graphics, then by all means...rate it a 2, but not because you don't like black. There is a difference.

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Apocalypse_67

Join Date 01/2003

looks matter more than functionality and performance. WAY, WAY, WAY more.

With this statement you are proving my point and contradicting yours.
If looks matter more, then personal opinions will come into play since everyone will rate according to how pretty the skin appears to them, and what might be pretty for some might be ugly to others.

What if I rated your skin poorly because it didn't have a roll-up button on the left side

Additional features don’t affect the performance of any particular skin if the skin is not design to have them. Understand that the skin should be rated for what it was designed for and how good the features on that particular skin work.
Per example; A standard skin (without any roll buttons, or media plug-in, or animations, or even sound) that functions perfectly should be rated based on the skin performance and not because it lacks any additional buttons and/or features. Keep in mind that these are optional features added by the author for his/her use and not because it is required/demanded on a skin.
Now, if the standard features that the skin must have don’t function, then that’s a different story.

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.people come here for skins that appeal to them visually...thats what it's all about.

I come for looks and functionality. Functionality is way more important to me. What good is a great looking skin if you can't close your browser page cos there is no button for it? Or what if the skin is so badly coded some of your taskbar icons stop coming up, even after you change back to the default skin and reboot? I have had this happen. The only way back, that I have found is to do a restore. I hate doing restores. Looks are only skin deep, (no pun intended) and no matter how good it looks, if it doesn't work right than it is useless.

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Apocalypse_67, I can see what your trying to say, the rateing system is more of a hindrance than anything else. That’s why I stopped looking at them as having any value and watch how much they are down loaded but, even that is effected by the rateings as you have just pointed out. So I guess that’s not even a good way to evaluate my work witch is what we are trying to say here.

As authors/artists we use the ratings/comments as a way to evaluate our own work so we know what we need to improve in our own works. This simply can not be done if no reason is given for a low rateing. Usability is a big part of a skin if it is given a low rating because it is hard to use with no explanation, how can we improve?

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