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nontroppo
Join Date 07/2005
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Discrimination and Server Response headers

Opera targetted to stop compressed content

July 9, 2005 4:46:47 PM from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
Hi,

I just did a packet analysis of the wincustomize site after an Opera user reported that WC was slower in Opera than other browsers.

What I found was that your main Microsoft IIS/6.0 server specifically targets Opera and refuses to use GZipped content, even though Opera fully supports it. In Firefox, 4 requests are gzip compressed, using almost 100kb less data.

If I fully cloak Opera (using the built-in cloaking config file), then I can force WC to engage compression, and the site displays fine. Also if I add "Opera" to Firefox user agent, I can stop compression for Firefox. This means your server is specifically targetting "Opera" in the user agent string. See here for more:

http://my.opera.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=984982#post984963

You should test the accept-encoding header sent by the client, not browser sniff in general. I hope you can get the server configuration sorted out.

Thanks,
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kona0197
Join Date 02/2003
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Reply #1 July 9, 2005 5:35:09 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
If I remember correctly a few key members here use Opera and have no problems whatsoever.

On the other hand - why not just use IE?
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nontroppo
Koasati
Join Date 07/2001
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Reply #2 July 9, 2005 7:14:24 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
First off kona, I guarantee you nontroppo knows his stuff. I visit the Opera forums quite often, and he is most knowledgable (unlike some who constantly inject their uninformed opinions) If he says he has found a problem, you can take it to the bank.
Secondly... you remember incorrectly.

On the other hand - why not just use IE?

*sigh*

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nontroppo
kona0197
Join Date 02/2003
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Reply #3 July 9, 2005 7:31:18 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
Well - forgive me then. Nevermind my comments.
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nontroppo
Lantec
Join Date 07/2003
+346 wcwizop
Reply #4 July 9, 2005 7:43:56 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
On topic: could this have something to do with the fix for the menus that were getting cut off a few weeks ago?

Off topic: Nontroppo or Koasati....I use a registered version of Opera 8.01, but I keep a copy of Maxthon on my computer for those sites that don't play nice with Opera. For some reason I cannot get Opera to stay as my default. Whenever there is a call from a program (like say in the "About" menu) it brings up Maxthon. I don't have Maxthon set as the default in it's options. In Opera I have the html and url files associated with Opera. I do use Outlook for mail and Xnews for newsgroups and RSS readers for RSS and XML associations. Occasionally it will open Maxthon even when Opera is already open. Any ideas?
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Corky_O
Join Date 04/2004
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Reply #5 July 9, 2005 7:51:14 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
K-

Will you or an Admin get this info where it needs to go?

Sounds awfully useful to me.
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Koasati
Join Date 07/2001
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Reply #6 July 9, 2005 8:52:25 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
You bet I will Corky..... if T-Man, or one of the other site coders doesn't respond to this thread, I call it to their attention on the Admin board.

Lantec... I don't know what might be causing that problem. You may need to ask on the Opera forums.

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nontroppo
nontroppo
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Reply #7 July 10, 2005 3:06:01 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
Just a bit more info. It may not be your programming, but something IIS/6.0 does automatically. The specific page I use for testing was https://www.wincustomize.com/Skins.aspx?LibID=28

I used Ethereal to monitor responses, and Proxomitron set to rewrite HTTP user agent headers (no other rules were active in the Prox filter list) as they left the browser. Ethereal allowed me to search all response headers that had gzip or deflated content. I found 4 compressed responses normally, 2 serverd by IIS/6.0 and 2 by a server software called Cafe (I assume they were from an adserver).

The main document server actively checks for Opera and then doesn't compress the content causing Opera to require some ~80kb more bandwidth to get the page. On broadband this slows down page loading by up to a couple of seconds.

Wizop: thanks!

On the other hand - why not just use IE?


Do you(http://www.stopie.com/) really want(http://browsehappy.com/) me to(http://channels.lockergnome.com/news/archives/20040615_why_you_should_dump_internet_explorer.phtml) answer that(http://nontroppo.org/wiki/WhyOpera)? (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=16922)
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Bichur
Join Date 10/2003
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Reply #8 July 10, 2005 3:37:09 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
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Fuzzy Logic
Join Date 05/2002
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Reply #9 July 10, 2005 3:42:28 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
Mostly use Firefox myself, with a few exceptions: this site (some tools only work in IE), my online bank account (logon only works in IE) and Windows Update. Rest of the time it FF all the way
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nontroppo
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Reply #10 July 10, 2005 3:54:10 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
On topic: could this have something to do with the fix for the menus that were getting cut off a few weeks ago?


No, this is related to the server itself, not the code that is sent.

For some reason I cannot get Opera to stay as my default. Whenever there is a call from a program (like say in the "About" menu) it brings up Maxthon. I don't have Maxthon set as the default in it's options. In Opera I have the html and url files associated with Opera. I do use Outlook for mail and Xnews for newsgroups and RSS readers for RSS and XML associations. Occasionally it will open Maxthon even when Opera is already open. Any ideas?


Hmmm, try setting the defaults in Opera when Maxthon is closed. As I see there is no way to "unset" maxthon as default in its preferences, so it may have something in its prefs that keeps stealing back associations (I never clicked that default button). I don't know where it stores these prefs so can't help you more. I know I have Opera and Maxthon and Opera always opens correctly.
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kona0197
Join Date 02/2003
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Reply #11 July 10, 2005 1:38:13 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
Nontroppo - I understand your security issues with IE6. I myself have never had a problem with security or viruses while using IE6.

Anyhow let's hope IE 7 is better and addresses alot of the problems people have with IE6.
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nontroppo
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Reply #12 July 13, 2005 3:02:54 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
Any update from the esteemed Wizops about this?

Nontroppo - I understand your security issues with IE6. I myself have never had a problem with security or viruses while using IE6.

Anyhow let's hope IE 7 is better and addresses alot of the problems people have with IE6.


My major problem personally has been the deliberate and inexcusable attempt to make the web a proprietary domain of a single company. I LOVE the Internet, it is an amazing evolution of human interaction and culture. I deeply believe no company should have control of which direction it will go. Politically an open Internet is essential. Microsoft don't share that view and IE is their wrecking vehicle to do so. The rendering engine of IE phenomenally breaks interoperability. As a sometimes web developer, having to work around an horrifically shoddy IE rendering engine to use such elegant technologies as CSS is painful in the extreme.

Just to be clear, the OS doesn't interest me. I haved loved Win 2K (XP is making me more upset the longer I use it). I don't care one way or the other about the company, which company is irrelevant to me. But don't mess with our Internet. IE7 will be more of the same. Their task to make the rendering core of IE finally respect web standards and interoperability is large, and they have shown little commitment publicly (I'd love to be proved wrong!) The security mess that is IE has sadly made the web a much more hostile place, but that is secondary IMO to the political implications of making the internet the playground of a(ny) single company.
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craeonics
Join Date 03/2001
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Reply #13 July 13, 2005 3:22:06 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
I would expect IIS to play foul. I don't get gzip-ed content either (Mozilla), so it's not just Opera.
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Koasati
Join Date 07/2001
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Reply #14 July 13, 2005 9:39:32 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
Any update from the esteemed Wizops about this?

I've pointed to this thread on the Admin board........ but that's all I can do. We'll just have to wait and see.

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T-Man
Join Date 03/2001
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Reply #15 July 13, 2005 4:14:47 PM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums
We use a third party utility for our site compression.  The product claims to work with Opera but it appears that this may not be the case.  I'll drop their support an email and see what they say.
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T-Man
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Reply #16 July 14, 2005 9:26:53 AM
from WinCustomize ForumsWinCustomize Forums

nontroppo,

Their support personell is asking what version of Opera you are using and also what is the User-Agent strings you are using so that they can try and reproduce the issues.

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