Frogboy

Join Date 03/2001

+2419

Earning money from skinning...

One of the things we've been wanting to do with WinCustomize 2005 (WC2K5) is to enable skin authors to earn income from contributing to the site.

One idea floating around works as follows:

The top 20 skinners would get a percentage of the quarterly revenue from WinCustomize subscriptions if they themselves are subscribers OR have Journeyman access or higher.

The top 20 would be calculated based on a point system that is derived from the # of WC subscriber downloads of their skins and themes. Some sections would count more than others (a WindowBlinds skin counts as 1 point, a wallpaper would count as half a point - we would post the point system so people could see how many points a download in each section would be but it would be largely based on effort and what areas we want to promote at that time).

What do you think?

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I like the idea. Maybe there could be some way that you could tie in the top 20 skinners with the creation of some premium content that would be available free to subscribers and at a cost to non-subscribers? This way, not only would the top 20 skinners benefit, but all subscribers would benefit and more free premium content would possibly increase subscriptions, which benefits everyone. Right now there are only two free premium skins available to subscribers.

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Frogboy

Join Date 03/2001

+2419

We were thinking of allowing authors to click a checkbox to make a given submission only available to subscribers.

After all, the more people who subscribe, the more $$ the top 20 earn.

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The only available to subscribers idea is wonderful. It would give a benefit to the people who do have a subscription and it may bring in new subscribers.
It really is only fair that people who support the site have more skins available to them.
Some people may not like the idea or use it because they want to see a higher DL count. I would rather know that my skins would be in an area that may be helping to support the site even further by hoping for more subscribers.
I would have the previews of the skin available though. I mean you want the non-subscribers to know what they are missing.

P.S. It would also be great for authors to have the option to change their past uploads to be viewed by subscribers only.
[Message Edited]

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Not sure if the and/or would be right. If the purpose is to boost subscriptions and your a Journeyman and not a subscriber why would they feel the need to subscribe. They will have the same benefit as those that subscribe do. Seems that would send the wrong message.
You can participate in the reward without subscribing.

I do like the idea. It is a way to reward those who have been supportive of the site and it does give the skinners something to work for.

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The idea sounds very good. I am hesitant to jump all over the bandwagon for some possible issues that might pop up. The first would be a drop in quality in work because downloads will become more important than quality.

It may be a bit ugly at first but I am sure it will come together as the bugs are worked out.

The system should just be fair and have all conflicts of interest removed where possible.

I also add the suggestion of a donation pool for the available akinners so that people that have already purchased a subscription can donate to that designated pool.

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WOM sees no drop off in quality as only the count would be from subscriber downloads. So if it stinks or is less in quality, it won't be downloaded, hence no count.

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I see your point WOM. I was thinking more along the terms of, whenever someone like tiggs or DanilloOc releases a skin. I download it automatically because of the author. If they started pumping out skins in response to downloads it would be a horrible tragedy. I would have to actually look at the screenshots.

Back to the regularly scheduled topic.

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Black Xero

Join Date 10/2001

+21

Great Idea.....
And I have something else to:

why not to have a SKIN OF THE MONTH, the perfect skin in all, and give some reward to its author????

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Skin of the month...Who picks that? Most downloads? The populatiry of the Author? The Mods? Journeyman and above?

NightTrain2002,I guess a lot of people Download using the authors name. I'am not one of those. I could care less who made it. Yes, some authors have a good rep. for doing good work, but if I don't like it, then it doesn't matter who makes it. I have some blinds from big name authors and some from lesser known ones.

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Frogboy

Join Date 03/2001

+2419

Yea, I always look at the screenshot.

Plus, it would give us a more valid excuse to be a bit stricter on moderation.

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goodmorphing

Join Date 03/2002

I think something like this is a good idea. I had been thinking that a place on the author's WC home page for them to put some means of receiving donations would be good.

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Black Xero

Join Date 10/2001

+21

#9 by WOM - 10/3/2004 12:05:43 PM Skin of the month...Who picks that? Most downloads? The populatiry of the Author? The Mods? Journeyman and above?

WOM, this, obviously, is responsibility of Mods. And the best skin in all means to have #1 Position in ratings, downloads, and the frequency and many other aspects like usability, compatibility, esthetics, etc......

sorry for my poor english....

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Download using the authors name

Yep that's me, I download all WOM's skins sight unseen

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Snowman

Join Date 03/2001

+343

hmm......

I've got another view on this:
Let's say that someone like me gets in the Top 20 (heaven forbid it). Most of my skins/themes are ports or at least based on other peoples work (I couldnt make a desent looking pixel if my life dependend on it)
Would it be fair that I would be able to "make money" off of other peoples 'sweat and tears'?

I, for one dont think so!

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kona0197

Join Date 02/2003

+86

I would have to agree with Snowman on this.

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Would the Top 20 be able to sell their "Skins" on their own Web Site as well as Wincustomise?

Would the Top 20 once selected remain static, or would they vary from quarter to quarter e.g. (1) could they be replaced by other skinners who become more popular or (2) if their skins are not selling at an acceptable level somebody else gets a go.

I would think it would have to be very competitive to maintain a high standard of product for sale, otherwise there will be enough acceptable standard available for visitors/others to ignore the "For Sale Sign".

Just some thoughts.

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Diafragma

Join Date 01/2003

+18

I doubt it if a port would be consider a premium skin...

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Phoon

Join Date 10/2001

+382

I don't care for the idea. I see disaster coming down the pipe.
Lets look at a couple things...
1. If you name a piece of garbage , Longhorn something, or Aero something, it gets alot of downloads just because of the name. Completely unfair.
2. Despite what anyone says, this community has been known to play favorites from time to time. That is just the nature of any grouping and is to be expected. However, when money is now involved it will lead to more arguments than we already have.

I vote to keep money out of it. Let the funds remain with Stardock to continue to enhance the site, products and bandwith. If someone wants to sell their work, do it elsewhere, or set up a section for non-free work. Let the artist post it there and give WC a commission for supplying the advertising venue.

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Snowy and Phoon raise some very good points................

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Jafo

Join Date 03/2001

+1846

A skin that's a 'port' could always have any 'income' split between skinner and images' originator. Wouldn't be that complicated....

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elvee

Join Date 03/2001

+113

Hmmm....I can understand that some people like the idea of getting paid for making premium stuff(not sure if premium should be the proper word).
In my opinion pooling skinners together and giving them a percentage based on a point system is asking for trouble.
Let people put up shop on their own pages, or create a Library for people that want to sell their stuff.

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Frogboy

Join Date 03/2001

+2419

My view is a little bit more straight forward:

This would a piece of the money derived from subscribers. If subscribers like ugly Longhorn ports (which they don't tend to - the subscriber download counts are quite different from the general user download counts at times) then that's what they like.

I really dislike elitism and I sometimes think our community reeks of it. It is not up to me or some moderator or some self-appointed "old timer" to say what skins are worthy and what skins aren't. As long as the skin author is a journeyman (meaning they've contributed a lot to the site in other ways over a period of time) OR is a paying subscriber, then if other subscribers are downloading their stuff then why shouldn't they be rewarded for that?

This discussion has nothing to do with premium skins or people selling their skins. This is purely a way for those skinners who are providing the content that subscribers like the most to get a piece of the pie.

We still plan to go ahead push forward on more premium skins. What I am talking here is more akin to a contest like the GUI Olympics except instead of a handful of judges, the paying subscribers (i.e. the people who pay part of the bills for this site) would vote with their downloads.

It would be every 3 months and then the download counts would be restarted again.

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As long as the skin author is a journeyman (meaning they've contributed a lot to the site in other ways over a period of time)

Ahem-Ahem (Chas clears his throat)

Great ideas Frogboy.

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It is not up to me or some moderator or some self-appointed "old timer" to say what skins are worthy and what skins aren't.

I guess I've never really looked at it from quite that angle............ but I'll admit to being guilty of the "old timer" mentality when it comes to certain things. And now that you've made me look at it, I think I don't like it much ........ time to turn over a new leaf, me thinks...

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Frogboy

Join Date 03/2001

+2419

I think many of us are (myself included).

I am all over the concept of not awarding any sort of merit medals to people who become popular calling their skin or theme or wallpaper "Something XP" or "Aero Thing".

But that's not what we're talking about here. If subscribers are paying us X thousands of dollars per month to support the site, it might be a good thing to let the top 20 or so skinners get a little piece of that. First off I think it would encourage more GOOD skins. I think it might encourage other people to make skins. And also, it might encourage more people to subscribe to teh site because they would know they are supporting the skinners too.

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