Durokk

Join Date 04/2009

[Guide] General Oak, the "damage hose"

First, some numbers, for perspective:

- Average base DPS of a DemiGod (not counting gear or skills) is: 104@L1, 137@L5, 184@L10, 296@L20.

- A single "Spirit" minion does DPS of: 13@tier1, 21@tier4.

- Ward 1 w/ 3 spirits totals 39 DPS, Ward 2 w/5 totals 78, Ward 3 w/7 totals 127, Ward 4 w/10 totals 208.

- Idol DPS is 11/15/21 @tier1, 30/41/43 @tier4.

- Six tier1 Idol minions totals 96 DPS, six tier4 Idol minions totals 228 DPS.

- The aggregate DPS for a creep wave is: 63 for (5)soldiers, 93 if (2)archers, 168 if (3)priests, 238 if (2)angels, 286 if (2)cats, 486 if (2)giants.

From the above, we observe that while minions individually have negligible damage, collectively they out-damage DemiGods by a wide margin. And while there are gear and skills which boost DemiGod damage, there are also gear and skills which boost minion damage.

So, this build focuses primarily on minion damage, and skills and gear which will boost that damage. My experience with this build is ~20 multi-player games, as well as playing through a "Hard" single-player tournament (I did not just make up a plan and post it without really trying it). My feeling is that this build is average-to-weak in the early game, but very strong mid-game, and an unstoppable powerhouse endgame. I am aware that not everyone will share my priorities and opinions expressed in this post, but that is OK, I respect all opinions (even those who disagree ) because diversity is a wonderful thing.

Strengths:

- A very strong endgame.

- A surplus of "sustained" damage, which be used to wear down any target quickly.

- An abundance of gold, due to killing enemy DemiGods by the truckload (starting in the middle-game).

Weakness:

- An average (at best) early game.

- A lack of "burst" damage, which makes killing enemy DemiGods a matter of careful attention, or they run/teleport and get away on you.

- A relatively frail defense, which can only be mitigated by very careful attention to your DemiGod positioning at all times.

Skill order:

1 - Raise Dead Ward I - +39 DPS for 3 spirits [not counting items] = nice boost to DPS.

2 - Soul Power I - gives me a +40 damage boost (@ 3 spirits), which is *huge* at lower levels (+80 @ 9 spirits later).

3 - Divine Justice I - that 10% healing/manna for your whole team adds up after while, especially if you cream the creeps.

4 - Penitence I - The 7% slow and +7% damage (of my minions too) really helps to kill enemy DemiGods. Cast Penitence at start of fight for the +7% damage, and it typically recycles *just* in time for you to use it as they try to flee (7% slow and interrupts their TP scroll).

5 - Raise Dead Ward II - +78 DPS for 5 spirits [not counting items] = nice boost to DPS.

6 - Surge of Faith I - 300 damage AE + 10% haste for your minions = badly mauled enemy DemiGod.

7 - Morale I - better minions do more damage.

8 - Last Stand I - The single best power *ever*, because if I die then +30% haste means I can usually kill whoever killed me. Even if I never die, simply having this skill allows me to "push the edge" just a bit harder.

9 - Raise Dead Ward III - +127 DPS for 7 spirits [not counting Morale and items], plus Soul Power I goes to +60 damage @ 6 spirits.

10 - Divine Justice II - 15% healing/manna for everyone is even better.

11 - Raise Dead Ward IV - +208 DPS for 10 spirits [not counting Morale and items], plus Soul Power I goes to +80 damage @ 9 spirits.

12 - Morale II - better minions do more damage.

13 - Divine Justice III - 20% healing/manna for everyone is even better.

14 - Morale III - better minions do more damage.

15 - Raise Dead Ward V - +234 DPS for 10 spirits [not counting Morale and items].

16 - Surge of Faith II - 450 damage AE + 15% haste for your minions = enemy DemiGod crying for his mama.

17 - Morale IV - better minions do more damage.

18 - Surge of Faith III - 600 damage AE + 15% haste for your minions = enemy DemiGod not having time to cry.

19 - Morale V - better minions do more damage.

20 - Morale VI - better minions do more damage.

Skill notes:

- 6 levels of "Morale" increases your 10 spirits from 234 to 453 DPS dps (not counting gear). Yeah, that IS a big improvement. Heck, that is big damage all by itself!

- "Soul Power" is very effective at the first level, but the later levels of “Soul Power” do not add much.

- Higher levels of "Penitence" do more damage, but damage output with this build is already abundant, "more" does not add much. Although "more" would be helpful for killing and enemy DemiGod when it starts to flee.

- "Rally" is nice, but killing an enemy DemiGod already adds a ton of health and manna, and I can't be healed "more than full", thanks.

- "Last Stand" gives +30% haste for 10 seconds, another level give +50%. If I can't kill the other guy with +30% I don't deserve the kill. The only use I can think of for "Last Stand II" is to kill Fortresses while your foes can do nothing to stop you so they end up cursing at you in chat.

- "Shield" is one power which I would have liked to fit in this build, but I can't quite manage it. And if I should ever die because I do not have Shield, then Last Stand kicks in *shrug*.

- The above is a guide, not a hard rule, I don't think I have ever followed it exactly, I am always swapping the order which I skills around. Think of the above as an "average".

Favor items which "stand out":

450 - Swift Anklet - cause faster is better.

675 - Totem of War - +5% Attack speed and +15 weapon damage for me, and +5 minion damage, yum.

1375 - Ring of Divine Might - +15 weapon damage for me, and +10 minion damage, big yum!

Gear order, early Game:

$900 - Monk Idol - biggest possible increase is both ranged DPS and survival.

$250 - TP Scroll - must *always* have (at least) one TP scroll.

$550 - Siege Archer Idol - nice ranged DPS.

$350 - Minotaur Berserker Idol - more melee DPS.

$750 - Gladiator Gloves - +5% speed for me (Soul Power already boosts my damage), and +4 damage for my minions.

$1000 - Boots of Speed - +10% movement speed is VERY important, you need to be able to close quickly and flee even more quickly.

$1250 - Wand of Speed - +25% movement speed for 8 seconds is a lifesaver when you are running for your life.

$1200 - Citadel Exp +10% - Levels for your team means that you will be more able to kill enemy DemiGods.

$600 - Citadel Firepower I - AE damage for you towers means that the creeps will not plow them.

$500 - Citadel Fortification I - Regen for your towers will keep them up, a LOT longer.

$1800 - Citadel Gold +4 - It pays back in just a few minutes, then it is all profit.

Gear order, mid Game:

$1500 - Nimoth Chest Armor (optional - With the aggregate damage output of this build, it is rare that an enemy DemiGod will stand toe-to-toe with you for long enough to really hurt you. If you can't master "keep yourself back", then no amount of defensive gear will keep you alive anyway. And if you *can* master not "leading with your face", then Divine Justice will typically keep your naked self at full health).

$1750 - Vlemish Faceguard (optional - Manna can be in short supply in the early/mid game. If having to use your skills sparingly bothers you, then buy a hat).

$2700 - Bishop Idol - better heals and more ranged DPS.

$2050 - Seige Demolisher Idol - more ranged DPS.

$1850 - Minotaur High King Idol - more melee DPS.

$2400 - Citadel Exp +20% - More levels for your team, more dying for their team.

$3500 - Gloves of Fell-Darkur - +30 damage for me, but mostly because +8 damage & 5% speed for minions.

$4250 - Heart of Life - never have to run back to your heal crystal again, and you will find yourself no longer holding back on skill use.

Gear order, end Game:

$8,000 - Mage Slayer - +12% Life Stealing, +25% haste (huge), and +45 damage. Once you acquire this, the resulting enemy DemiGod killing spree almost always results in a "win".

$18,000 - Ashkandor - +12% Life Stealing, +25% haste (huge), +120 damage (huge). Better yet, 10% of 4x critical, and your base damage is already high due to Soul Power so that critical can practically one-shot an enemy DemiGod. But even better is the +15 minion damage and +15% minion haste, it is like putting a turbo on your killing machine. If you get to this, everything following is irrelevant, you have a won game.

$13,000 - Belt of the Giants - +50 damage is nice, but the 100% Cleave means you will slaughter local enemy creeps while you pound on the enemy DemiGod. This helps keeps your health/manna up due to Divine Justice. Whee.

$3,600 - Citadel Exp +30% - more levels, more enemy dying, whee.

$4,800 - Citadel Exp +40% - more levels, more enemy dying, whee.

$15,000 - Unmaker - more minion damage, whee.

$25,000 - All Father's Ring - more minion damage, whee.

Gear notes:

- The best source of gold is killing (or assisting to kill) enemy DemiGods. Work on that.

- Do not hesitate to detach your spirits to help your allies kill an enemy DemiGod, that is just "free gold". And your spirits move fast and will replenish on their own if killed.

- Remember to keep an eye on how much gold you have accumulated, so you know when to run back and spend it.

- Don't worry about buying every last piece of gear listed, or buying them in the exact order. The gear listed is just a guide and/or some ideas. Do what feels right for the game sitution.

Tactics, Early Game:

- Do not die. Get used to sending the minions in first, and using the minions to pursue. Only engage yourself if enemy DemiGod is well committed and you are safely distant from an enemy tower/fort.

- You will sometimes die anyway, because you are frail. Learn from it, and remember to hit the shop/citadel when you come back.

- Use your idols by your healing crystal, before you run off. Manna is in short supply in the early game.

- You excel as a creep-killer, focus on that. You are OK as a flag capturer, do what you can. You suck as a tower destroyer, stay clear. You would like to kill enemy DemiGods, but you are not that good at it, yet.

- Check the flags to see if any of them are the +20% exp flag, and if you find one head for that.

Tactics, Mid Game:

- Do not die. Get better at pulling yourself back a bit at the slightest danger, and slamming Penitence and Surge of Faith on enemy Demigods. Anyone pursuing you through your full minion swarm is going to get worn down to "easy kill" fast.

- If you have a Raise Dead Ward down in an area where things are dying, then consider sending your spirits off to attack something halfway across the board. By the time they all die, you will have replenished them. This is good for supporting ally DemiGods, tagging enemy DemiGods who are about to die for the gold, and finishing off towers or even forts which are far away.

- Creeps fuel you, seek them out. Enemy towers can be killed by first swarming them with spirits (which replenish for free), and then you and your idol minions pile on. Make sure that you keep that +20% exp flag, and keep the enemy away from your base portal flags. Once you figure out which enemy DemiGods you can kill, beat the TAR out of them, and eventually you will be able to kill them all.

- Work on controlling your minions:

M = select minions to attack or pursue

H = select DemiGod to pull back

N = select everyone to "pile on"

I = select spirits to send them on "special ops mission".

- Remember to keep a "Raise Dead Ward" down near you at all times.

Tactics, End Game:

- Do not die. Don't get overconfident. You CAN kill four enemy DemiGods in succession, but not all at once. You CAN kill enemy DemiGods at their healing crystal, but not multiples simultaneously.

- Focus your minions on a single target to have it die fast. Keep refreshing the idols and putting down "Raise Dead Ward" as you move.

- If you are having problems pushing far enough to win, upgrade your teams creeps. Giants are effective, and so are the Blacksmith damage upgrades.

- Take over enemy portal flags, the sudden imbalance of creeps in your favor is *huge*.

- Plow mercilessly to your goal, slaughtering everything in your path, especially the enemy DemiGods.

References:

1) The "Demigod Ability FAQ", with some good skill infos:

http://www.gamefaqs.com/computer/doswin/file/944424/56322

2) The "Scarylogic" forum guides, which have some great numbers:

http://www.scarylogic.com/viewforum.php?f=4

3) A google spreadsheet from (er, I don't know who), listing the DemiGod stats (no clue how he got them):

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pmbS09ByNPGE-hT1mq5_XBQ

4) My "scratch" Demigod spreadsheet, with all sorts of comparison and calculations:

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pXVcxoA1bDloe4deHNiA_UQ&hl=en

Don't take this one at face value, the "conclusions" which could be drawn from that sheet are baseless without an understanding of how the sheet was put together. For example: "OMG Oak DPS is SO much higher than Beast, that is just WRONG." .. Correct, that is wrong - because I didn't "count" skills that are "triggered", like Beasts “Venom Spit”, “Foul Grasp”, “Bestial Wrath”, “Post Mortem” / “Plague” (all of which are huge DPS boosts) - while for Oak I didn't count the "triggered" skills “Penitence”, or “Surge of Faith” (both of which do help with DPS, but are nowhere near the boosts that the Beasts "not counted" skills are).

Hope this guide is helpful!

PS: If I got anything wrong, or just missed something, please do not hesitate to speak up.

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the_iron_troll
Xenogrant
fabio80mi
Zyvvrict
NeoPhalanx
Beejnr
Lemminkaeinen

Flat out awsome! I've been working at a build for the General side of Oak.. glad someone beat me to it and did it better!

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Do you not have a very hard time finishing people off with level 1 Penitence (Wand of speed doesnt make up for burst ranged damage and slow, especially if the enemy runs into towers)? My build I use for Oak is very similar to this except I put ranks into Penitence instead of Morale and only one rank into Divine Justice because I don't feel 10% is worth 2 skill points (that could go into Penitence for example), mainly because with the gold you get from being able to finish off low health runners and harassing demigods out of your lane with Penitence you could buy some +minion stat expensive items earlier instead to replace the lost damage from Morale if you drop it for ranks in Penitence, and keep in mind the debuff from Penitence is against ALL damage, so that includes your minions damage.

Also no armors in early game? You will be very squishy, and minons aren't usually enough to deter someone early game from pursuing you for an easy kill, I usually invest in at least banded mail regardless of who I'm against.

Apart from those points it's pretty good, I love using spirits to harass people, most Oaks I see just park their spirits in their base or don't order them about at all which is a huuge waste.

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very nice guide. its not at all how i play Oak, but you're strategy is consistent and effective. i've used a very similar build myself from time to time.

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Thanks folks!

Quoting IllegalDustbin,

reply 2

Do you not have a very hard time finishing people off with [only]level 1 Penitence

Excellent question. The short answer is "sometimes I do in the early game, definitely not in the late game".

The Spirits do a LOT of damage once you get them Moral-ed up, move VERY fast, and are expendable (because if you have a ward down anywhere near any creeps, they replenish themsevles quickly). As such, once you hit about level 8, if you swarm the enemy DemiGod with all your minions as he comes in, the minions are all ON him once he gets close enough for you to hit him with "Penitence" (200 damage, +7% damage for 5 seconds) and then hit "Surge of Faith" (300 damage, +10% minion damage for 7 seconds). During the next 5 seconds that DemiGod will take a hellish ammount of damage, almost certainly more than he can sustain. At level 8 (assuming minions out from 3 tier1 idols and no other damage items), if you hit him with both skills right as all the minions arrive at once (while unlikely to be that precise, it makes my math easier) over the next 5 seconds that comes out to damage something on the order of 500skills + ((261oak + 216spirit + 96idols) * 1.17damageboost * 5seconds) = 3,800 damage (less armor reduction). The average level 8 DemiGod has 2585 hitpoints, the max has 3100 (plus items and armor reduction). To take the extreme case, at level 20 (assuming minions out from 3 tier4 idols and no other damage items), it comes out to 800skills + ((418oak + 453spirit + 228idols) * 1.27damageboost * 5seconds) = 7,700 damage (less armor reduction). The average level 20 DemiGod has 3970 hitpoints, the max has 4750 (plus items and armor reduction).

So, while this "general" Oak build does not have a "zot you're dead" spike damage skill, he does so much sustained damage that enemy DemiGod fatality occurs in seconds.

Quoting IllegalDustbin,

reply 2

I put ranks into Penitence instead of Morale

"Morale" results in a very high sustained DPS, far higher than most people realize when you have 6 levels of it, and you get an especially good boost for it with Oak. I respect your preference, but I find that with a high sustained DPS, "Penitence I" does the job for me.

Quoting IllegalDustbin,

reply 2

Also no armors in early game?

Sometimes I do, but often I can skip them entirely, it depends on how the enemy DemiGods treat me. If at all possible I try to level on creeps / flag captures in the early game and generally avoid the enemy DemiGods (or at least not seek them out), because I know that I am squishy. But don't discount the damage that those minions do, even from level 1. At level 1, the first thing I do is get a ward down in a creep lane to get 3 spirits out. That gives me a sustained DPS of 110oak + 39spirit + 42idol = 191, which is more than most DemiGods can put out at that level. And, the idol DPS is ranged, plus the spirit DPS may as well be, so that helps with the runners. It is not great, but it is not terrible either.

Quoting IllegalDustbin,

reply 2

most Oaks I see just park their spirits in their base or don't order them about at all which is a huuge waste.

I could not agree more. I have on several occasions used my spirits by themselves to take out a distant enemy fortress which I could not get to. All I had to do was park in a creep lane with a ward up, and every now and then hit I and sent the spirit swarm off. The other team was quite displeased when I came up with that one, haw. This does not work well if the enemy fortress is surrounded by towers, but is incredibly effective if it is alone. And I use spirits to chase a fleeing DemiGod all the time, usually that just results in dead spirits (no big deal) but sometimes it works (bonus).

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This is a good guide, but there are some points I'd like to state.

You have to take the damage calculations with a grain of salt, if the enemy has the least amount of knowledge then they would know that you will do almost only phisical damage with this build and counter it by buying large amounts of armor. Also you say that 'most' demigods have around 5k hp(i've seen plenty which have 8K+ hp with decent damage) when lvl 20~ which is also not so true if they knew what they were up against. To counter you I would need a few things and thats large amounts of health, leech, armor, and a Belt of the Giant (or the similar gloves). Getting these items will completely destroy your build as the minions have around 2k~ hp and with a Belt of the Giant you hit at least 3 or 4 of them at a time.

For instance, if say Rook would stun Oak with his boulder roll skill and then hammer slam you and your minions. Oak would have to run.

Or if say another Assassin based Oak was fighting a Minion based Oak. At later levels he will have maxed shield maxed penitence and maxed Surge or something similar to that. If he focuses his damage on you then you will take ALOT of damage since you dont have alot of health. He will be able to fight for a few seconds before he gets low health and casts Shield on him, thats 6 seconds which he can use to gain full health back from a HoL. He will get at least 3 penitance shots at you and 2 times surge of faith which is a total of 3600 spell damage which negates armor. On top of that he will do some damage with his axe. Since you have almost no health or armor items it will be verry hard to beat him.

Same thing goes for damage. A torchbearer will tottaly decimate your army and damage you in the proces. If he is a hybrid he will first use some ice spells to damage and freeze your army and using shatter to damage you. And high single target fireball to finish you off.

Take all these numbers and information losely as they prolly arent accurate. I couldn't be arsed to do precision calculations.

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Great guide. Whether you like to play this style or not, this is extremely good stuff to know, especially since you will probably have to fight a build like this eventually.

It hit the spot too. I just got done posting that I wished there was a source for minion damage information.

+1 For effort, usefulness of information, and pioneering some Demigod Mathcrafting

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Minion builds do a lot of damage and give a lot of lane control but they rarely get killing blows because almost all minions can't shoot at running targets and none (as far as I know) can swing on the run. This means once someone decides to leave the fight they can.

That being said, all you have to do is stand back a little ways and let your minions do all the work and you can control a lane and take down towers.

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People are often under the misunderstanding that to win a game, you need to single out and take down DGs. While this does give you gold to upgrade, buy better stuff to kill DGs faster, there are other tactical factors that can win the game. Taking control of a lane and pushing it back deep into thier side causes more issues than chasing DGs all over.

I used this build in 10 skirmish fights last night, and I think this is a solid field control build. I often pick a lane, pop my flag down and build a force to kill creeps with.. this gives me gold and xp (not as much as taking down DGS directly but that comes later). Once I have a solid damage base going, I push up taking down towers along my creep path, capping flags as they come, if a enemy DG comes into view, I send my minions after him to gauge how they will react... if they come straight for me, I pull back a little, letting my buddies wittle him down.. once Im confident I can engage, I pop pent on him and proceed to get a kill. I cant tell you how many times during a fight I would see a DG come in thinking Im an easy mark and is sitting at 50-60% by the time I even begin swinging, they do turn tail real quick, and often end up eating dirt.

Lane control is a often overlooked strat... discarded for the aforementioned DG farming, then wondering how the other side just capped your rear portals and having giants knocking on your citadel door.

Again... good guide, as often said in it.. its a framework build..to be altered based on the fight. Now to work on my QoT one.

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Sorry, my reply wasn't meant to indicate that lane control and minion builds are bad, quite the opposite actually. However, without knowing that people will try this build, get 0 kills, and say it sucks.

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Quoting Sonolegolas,

reply 5

Also you say that 'most' demigods have around 5k hp(i've seen plenty which have 8K+ hp with decent damage) when lvl 20~

We are both correct. I am stating that value without considering gear or skills, you are stating the value seen "in real life" (which includes gear and skills). I point out that my DPS numbers also do not include gear, nor do they (except where clearly noted) include the "burst" skills, which makes the comparison relatively fair on both ends, as both can be increased with gear and skills. I also point out that the level 20 8k+HP demigod would last 5.2 seconds against my minions (longer if he has armor, and he will - shorter if I have damage enhancing items, and I will).

Quoting Sonolegolas,

reply 5

if say Rook would stun Oak with his boulder roll skill and then hammer slam you and your minions.

You know, I have NEVER seen that actually done successfully.

Quoting Sonolegolas,

reply 5

you will do almost only phisical damage with this build and counter it by buying large amounts of armor.

Quoting Sonolegolas,

reply 5

these items will completely destroy your build

Quoting Sonolegolas,

reply 5

A torchbearer will tottaly decimate your army and

Yeah yeah, there are counters to everything. I am neither arguing that, nor am I claiming that the build presented is a "sure win" which cannot be countered.

Quoting Sonolegolas,

reply 5

Take all these numbers and information losely as they prolly arent accurate. I couldn't be arsed to do precision calculations.

They ARE accurate, but only relvant if you could be arsed to understand what is included in them, and what is not.

Quoting Beejnr,

reply 6

I just got done posting that I wished there was a source for minion damage information.

I also noticed that same lack, and while my post certainly did not answer every need in that regard, I hope it was a start. The sources I quoted have some great info in them as well!

Quoting NeoPhalanx,

reply 8

I used this build in 10 skirmish fights last night, [...] I cant tell you how many times during a fight I would see a DG come in thinking Im an easy mark and is sitting at 50-60% by the time I even begin swinging, they do turn tail real quick, and often end up eating dirt.

I do love hearing from people who have actually tried it out. Thank you for sharing your success sir!

Quoting Micah,

reply 9

However, without knowing that people will try this build, get 0 kills, and say it sucks.

Not trying it, but nonetheless declaring that "it sucks", makes kittens cry. You get "double points" for replying that way right after the guy above you posted that he actually tried it and that it worked for him.

Cheers!

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Not trying it, but nonetheless declaring that "it sucks", makes kittens cry.

I think you think Micah was saying your build sucks, but he wasn't. Quite the opposite; he was warning others not to say "it sucks" unless they've tried it.

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This is a little tough to get used to for me, but I like it and will keep trying it until I can make it work. I think it has good potential in a lot of matches (and its team friendly).

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That is pretty much the same build I use with a few tweaks. One, I ignore the morale upgrades for most of the game, and instead get penitance. The decreased speed and increased damage is a huge help. Also, I tend to go for a more long term approach via equipment. If I can afford it, I go hungarlings crown, godplate, duelists, ashkandor, and the last slot is used for whatever I need, be it speed, more health, or damage. Worked like a charm, 10 kills 2 deaths, and both deaths were as I tried desperately to run the enemy away from the citidel.

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This is an awesome build. I really enjoy playing it because of the depth, variety to it.

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Good guide, I play assassin Oak myself and I feel that Heart of Life is best used with shield. I mean don't get me wrong I know you could easily run back into your towers and wait for DoT's to wear off but typically when you are pushing into a base for the win that is not always possible. Even more so if the enemy DG is chasing you down a shield + HoL could save you a trip to the graveyard.

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I usually play Oak a lot, and I have never really gone the general path. After reading this I thought I'd give it a try.

Gotta say this is a nice build, great job. Play'd 3 2v2's now against players and we destroy'd em, It does start abit slow, but not hard to still force other DG's out of the lanes, if play'd right.

I was also skeptical about the pentience, but lvl 1 is really all you need. So far... Can't say Ive seen how this is end game though since we have been winning our games before I can hit lvl 14.

Like said above, of course their are counters against this, but this is still a very useful build.

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Lots of detailed info, and several things I've been looking for, thanks. By any chance do you know if items that enhance the damage of your "minions" includes idol minions? 8X10 is good, but 8X16 would be better. I kinda hope it does, because that would even out the effect of those items on Sedna/QoT vs Erebus/Oak; 4-10 is a much bigger difference than 10-16.

EDIT: And, like you put one point into Soul Power because the first level is very helpful but the later levels are much less so, you might want to put a single point into shield (say, replacing the level 7 morale). Although it costs a lot of mana, has a long cooldown, and lasts a measly three seconds... invincability on command is useful. The last game I played it saved me from three guarenteed deaths from snipe or fireball, it's helpful if you get ambushed (three seconds = a teleport scroll cast, or quite a distance ran with +speed items), can save an ally just as easily as you, or used offensively (late game, three seconds of free attacks = like half your enemy's hp or more). Another thing about it is the psychological benifit- your enemy doesn't know if it'll last 3 seconds or 6, and invincability on, say, UB or Rook is a huge threat and can send some players packing then and there.

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I have been playing Oak for entire week. I used to play him as an assassin and I did pretty good in matches, but my winning streak didn't last for so long. IMO, it's best to play him as a general and assassin because he is capable of being both. My strategy is to get Priest rank 3 and Archer rank 4 then one point or two points into Raise Dead. Afterward, I'll buy basic gear to increase my mana and health and usually by level 8 I can havev 4.6k and alot of minion. I carry a amulet of teleportation for sudden attack. Imagine, you are trying to capture an flag and an OAK with ton of minion ports to you then PENTINENCE you . You are pretty much dead if you dont move quickly. With this build, I have enough HP and DPS to take down an assassin Oak.

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Quoting SolaceAvatar,

reply 17

By any chance do you know if items that enhance the damage of your "minions" includes idol minions?

I can confirm that items DO affect idol minion damage.

Test method I used:

- Set up a single seige archer (idol level 1) to fire on an out-of-the-way tower. Record tower HPs 5x. Calculate base damage as 31.

- Purchase Gladiator Gloves. Record same seige archer on same tower 5x. Calculate damage now as 35. Which is +4 to previous (an exact match to what Gladiator Gloves adds to minion damage).

- Purchase Gloves of Fell-Darkur. Record same seige archer on same tower 5x. Calculate damage now as 43. Which is +8 to previous (an exact match to what Gloves of Fell-Darkur adds to minion damage).

Incidentally, that is the core strength of this build. Any one of the skills in themselves are merely average at best. It is the way the minions, skills, and items all combine, and reinforce each other, that makes it so devastating. If everything lines up for Oak, he can (for about five seconds), put out more damage than any other DemiGod(*), and focus it all on a single target. Done right, it is sweet indeed.

(*) Except for a tower-farmed up Rook, but nobody is going to run in to fight a Rook in the middle of 8 towers. Fortunately, Rook towers are neither mobile nor aimable, and their damage cannot be enhanced by anything, so late-game they lose their "most damaging" status.

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Here's a question: for your initial minions, do you cast-sell them, or just buy them? Considering this builds reliance on minions, I can see you outright buying them, because losing a monk early game would be like losing your arm. >.<

Also, Durokk, UB would definitely fight a rook in an 8 tower farm, if they were close enough together.... I love high level venom spit. Kills one tower, hurts the rest so much that It's just a couple melee attacks. By that time... more spit!

I'll try this build out. It looks kickass.

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Durokk- Wow, thanks. That's pretty awesome to know. Since that works... I wonder if morale works on idols too. If it does, I might actually try the pure-general build sometime.

Milsk- I definately buy monks straight off. They give +20 dps, can distract things that want to hurt me, take point in dangerous situations, and the healing they do is the fastest way to regenerate hp without pots, hol, or running back to base.

One thing I tried toward the latelategame, when I'd otherwise be saving for an Ashkandor, was to buy a Girdle of the Giants instead. I hadn't thought at the time, but this works really well with Divine Justice. Although the splash has a pretty short range, by the end of the game (when you can afford this), the lanes will be just clogged with creeps, and even if it only hits 1-2 things, that means you're doing at least two to three times the damage you normally would. Although usually you'd want to focus on things that can kill demis by that point, because Oak gains health for himself and all nearby allies whenever he gets a kill, even accidentially he gains tremendous regen through this. I was under attack by three enemy demis and a wave or two of creeps, someone hit me down to a third hp at once... and I gained it back in under two seconds. I actually wiped out all three demis, the creeps, and a tower or two, all on my own... well, no demi backup, at least. My own minions and creeps where equally unkillable. Note: I'd already bought a Mage Killer, which I'd suggest buying when avalable before this.

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i will be learning general Oak for my first charecter in Demigod..thanks for the guide

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I have a quite different approach on the rare time i played Oak but your well written guide convinced me to try your way

+1 karma

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Great write up! I've been playing mostly Regulus and got sick of everyone else being Reg so I needed a change for a while. Oak when played by a good player always slaughtered me so I wanted to figure out how this guy works. By the way, I think anyone look for a counter to a DG should actually play that DG to see what makes it tick.

The biggest issue with this build is that it can be weak until level 5 or so if you keep getting charged by DGs in your lane. Thus you can't farm kills and the UB slaughters you. I'm going to try in the future to get armor up first along with the monks to see if this helps. Blood of the Fallen may help as well although the swift anklet would be hard to give up.

And it's hard to keep yourself back. It's so easy to charge up forward if you take out a couple waves. Perfect opportunity to get picked off by an enemy DG and you've got a long way to get back. Need to stay back until level 5-7. But once you get to level 10 or so with this build you can really start to push forward. It's pretty amazing to see yourself in the middle of a creep wave with full compliment of minions and a dozen or so spirits. I've been on the other end of that and couldn't figure out how. Now I know. And with this you can quickly take down a tower or two before the other team can counter.

You won't get as many kills with this build against a good team, especially with UBs, but this build is a great support role and rusher mid to late game. I've also found that you can still get a good bit of gold even without DG kills.

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Durokk, THANK YOU. I had been looking for some hard numbers on minions for a goodly while, and I don't know where you found those (or what Heavy armour means), but I now have Something, which is infinitely better than Nothing.

Again, Thank You.

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[Guide] *General* Oak, the "damage hose"

[Guide] *General* Oak, the "damage hose"

[Guide] General Oak, the "damage hose"

[Guide] General Oak, the "damage hose"