Hi NT can you give a link to Zoomba's post?

I support all promotion of skins.  Here or there and everywhere.
If Joe Master or Joe Brycewall want to try their hand at marketing in a way that doesn't violate the TOS (specifically section 'm' : "Interfere with another member's use and enjoyment of the Service or another entity's use and enjoyment of similar services") more power to them.  The market and moderators will handle any "issues".

Some guild lines might be nice but precedent works well enough too.

My opinion as a WC subscriber.

I didn't get to see Z71's post before it was altered; are we talking about work that is not uploaded to this site but is promoted here?

Hmm, it's a slippery slope.

I guess I'd be okay with a long-standing community member with the rank of Master promoting their off-site work here. It might also be in how it is promoted; i.e. is it more of an ad than a friendly notice to the community?

I'm not a skinner, so I hope you don't mind my 2-cents worth. I see no harm in promoting off-site work by master skinners. What I don't want to see is the forums become some kind of "flea-market" or yard sale advetisement for anyone who thinks they can skin.

Once again, just my 2-cents worth (that's mexican money, 2 centavos, or .002 american cents... I'm cheap like that   )

vStyler, you mean if you were ever to stop uploading here (perish the thought!), you wouldn't drop us a line on what your latest and greatest is at the moment?

I think it's great to have the Masters be a big part of the community as well as keeping their work on site, too (as with most of your work), but if for some reason a Master couldn't/didn't upload here anymore I don't think that should be the last we ever hear of them. So long as they are an active part of the community I think any promotion of their work would be of an informative nature rather than a BUY BUY BUY! nature. If we didn't hear from them ever, except when they wanted to promote their skin, then I'd say something was.....fishy.

I guess anyone would feel...self-conscious about self-promotion but I think being a Master might give you more entitlement to that. As I understood the terms of being a master, there is alot of trust that goes into promoting someone to that rank; trust that they have the best interest of the community at heart rather than purely selfish motives. Trust that they strive for excellence and not just the quickest and largest download count. From the Masters I've seen/heard from the most (you included), they each have those qualities. I would hope people like that wouldn't try to shamelessly take advantage of the Master rank or the WC community.

Of course, there's no guarantee on that, which is why I still think it's a slippery slope. It may be easier to give hard-line 'you may not promote off-site work here' and close the case, but if it is a categorical 'yes, you can promote your off-site work here' there definitely needs to be some ground rules or guidelines. It is way too easy for an ill-intentioned person to take advantage and go over the top with spam.

Ah, but that's only if the hypothetical rules would limit promoting off-site work to Masters; which might actually be a good guidline but might rub some people the wrong way.

Self-promoting doesn't bother me. If the quality of the skin is good and people like it, as a Master skin it really shouldn't 'need' promoting. The Masters have their own space on the front page for their top skins, to boot. But if someone feels the need to promote it, I really don't see a problem with a 'single' thread for that skin. In the end, folks are only going to buy it if 'they' like it.

I do have a problem with Master skins being promoted on other sites 'before' they are posted here. I look at being made 'Master' as a huge privilege. I think WC should hold the Master's to similar guidelines as they do when running certain contests. It should appear here first and only here for a set amount of time, after which they can release it on their site or wherever they chose. I don't know, maybe they can make more on it releasing it on their own site first (no percentage taken? I don't know) but I think that besides having to earn the title of Master, having them post here first should be part of keeping that title. It makes sense to me because of how it was all addressed from the start, that WC was 'giving back to the skinners' and that the percantage WC was taking on each sale was going back into running the site.

I wish I could edit the thread to title to "Offsite premium skins".

NT, don't know if that was in response to me..but incase..I meant that I didn't have a problem if they promoted a skin they posted 'here'...not on another site.

Ditto

That would be my personal preference and sentiment on the issue, as well. So if those were the rules (i.e. only Masters can do it) I don't think there would be a wide-spread problem of exploitation, seeing as how most of the Masters wouldn't take advantage of the community.

Then the only remaining issue would be, 'does the skin have to be uploaded to this site as well?' After thinking about it, I think it'd be safer to just say 'yes, it does'. Or, at least there should be plans to upload to WC if it isn't already. You can't always rely on common courtesy when you're thinking long-term; things change, people change.

I'm still ruminating over a hypothetical where the Master was in good-standing with the community and the site but just didn't upload here anymore (it's a stretch, I know, but I still think it should be considered or discussed). How would that Master go about informing his friends/people who might be interested, that are part of WC, without making a post here? Email all of them or just hope the word will spread?

Where there is a will there is a way...Smart marketing and a good product goes a long way towards success. I have gone from a couple of hits a day to over 3500 daily in a few months, I expect that number to grow as our body of work grows. I feel that if your work is of the highest quality then yes.. the word will spread. Realistically my site will never be close to the amount of patronage at WC though and because of that the Master program affords me an extra outlet to a larger audience in trade for a % of the profits. I also think it is important to continue to provide free community suites as repayment and as a sign of our gratitude. I personally like the way things are set up right now, Its fair and everyone wins.

Others may feel differently..