Only the Quad core 2.5 with a 7800 (closest in graphics performance to my 2 7600GTs) got anywhere near my framerates with UT2004. The spec of that machine pushes the price to four times the cost of my pc.

You may like your Mac, but they are just not value for money.

the quad should be faster (i mean 4 cores....)

4 cores that are crap.

Meowy, i came to WC just to not get my mac book pro depressed with the LUNA theme, as i cant handle excel for mac, and its a program i use often at work, its the same as the one in pc, except all versions use de same formulas as the one in english for pc, and i only know how to use them in spanish LOL, and as i said, windows is a nice OS, and as i differ with all here, i accept that its good, sometimes unstable but good, what i really find interesting is how pc "likers" repell osX soo baad, even though is a great system as well...wonder why,maybe not the popular opinion is the correct one! Oh, and i mind saying again, well the mac ads are terribly rude, except from the hi im a pc, and im a pc too, that one has spark, dont blame apple, microsoft did in its time waaay more dirty things, that's how the market works, just search for QDOS, and see how dirty microsoft is.

Most of this discussion is about the hardware.. OK. Forgive me if this has already been stated, but there is a lot of hardware out there. A lot of hardware is crap. Some of the crap can also be plucked into a Mac as well as the PC.
On the software side, Windows has to be able to run on all this hardware that is out there. Mac OS only has to run on what Apple puts in their machines. Most likely if you pluck your OS X install DVD into your Dell or whatever you have, the install won't go so well and OS X will not boot. As we have found out with Windows.. hey! It can run on PC and Mac, without hacking the code!... because of its design to work on everything (except ENIAC, UNIVAC, etc). That's part of why it isnt as stable as Mac OS. But, OS X can crash too, it's happened to me.

Windows: Reliable, runs on anything you feed it.
Mac OS: Very reliable, only runs on specific configurations.

Surely the whole point of this discussion is that before Mac went Intel inside you could spend twice as much on a mac and be happy that you had a unique (and as Steve Jobs always said before "better")architecture (IBM G5 people! Motorola G4 is like P3 speed)
However now that Steve and boys are shouting about how much better Intel's chips are (completely the opposite of what they were saying 12 months ago) you can now say HEY! that £1800 macbookpro has the same spec as my £800 Acer! And guess what the Acer runs OSX86 just as fast

OH & btw, its good to do some reasearch first on what the computer offers u, look at the link

http://www.apple.com/powermac/dualcore.html

I hope ur pc will manage 4tb of ram in the near future NOT!

well show me a pc which can handle de 4tb ram right now, plus as far as i know, vista is still bios! QUOTE Windows XP, and even the upcoming Vista, are stuck in the 1980s with old-fashioned BIOS. Sorry to dissapoint u, maybe happened the same with WINFS? or with the 2000,0000,0000 promises they cut off vista.leopard might not me major, as some pc guys use as excuse, but vista is surely not the change between OS 9 to OSX im sorry, but its simply the truth.

I shouldn't be bothered with you, you just don't get it.
You said 'near future', not now.

And plenty of news sources have stated that Vista WILL support EFI, in the 64-bit version.

The only feature MS has promised that hasn't been fufilled is WinFS, and even a year or two ago they said it wouldnt make it. Fortunately, they have made Vista search just as good as WinFS IMO.

vista is surely not the change between OS 9 to OSX

No-one ever said it would be.

You really should do your reasearch before you start rambling about.

Huh? Stop going into outer space here.

You said my PC wont handle 4 teras of Ram in the future, I say it will.
I never said Apple hadn't done it already. Plus they don't manufacture the actual hardware. As far as I know, Intel does it

vista will still be a nice winxp.

Unfortunately, this is not correct.

The graphics driving code is completely different. This is just one of the differences.

Personally, I do not consider a computer anything more than a tool, so I have no interest in degrading others for their efforts (whether it be a person or a company).

Microsoft is starting to move in the direction of "Live" services with the departure of Bill Gates from the day to day runnings of the business. He is now working in the areas of providing better futures for others by providing funds for many education based programs.

At some point, the use of Microsoft as the "big bad wolf" will end, and another enemy will have to be found for the ever present need to fight.

OH and one more thing dont take bill gates as a giving charity god

I don't think he is a god (far from it). My point was that he is leaving the daily running of MS to others now, and is pursuing a path that will help others and leave a statement about the things he cares about in the end.

IMO - life is a culmination of all that one does, the bad and the good, which can only be truly summarized at the end.

From my understanding, he believes in treating problems not by throwing money at them, but by educating people on the cause of problems and how to prevent them (the teaching of which will be done by others). His willingness to provide funding towards programs that fit this definition is just one example of a wealthy person wanting to give back to the world which has provided so much for that person. The recent support of Warren Buffet is another example of the great possibilities of what funded organizations can do for the world.

When you compare the generosity of these possibilities to the business environment currently supporting the "Mac vs. PC" battle, it seems to put the human element into perspective - at least from my point of view.

I think it is great that there are different machines with different operating systems, and feel that each provide a great experience for many different people.

lolapoa,

You have some valid points, though it would be great if you could place some line breaks between some of your sentences which would result in easier reading.

No offense intended, just a simple step toward an accepted approach to presenting words in a legible way (not that I am a well honed professional writer).

but they crash more often, have more virus more often,etc

Was in my local Apple store.....another customer was complaining his G4 was freezing and crashing while he was editing DVD's, that the only way he could get out of lock-up was to hard shut down and restart. The store clerk suggested that intensive graphics work can do that (even on a Mac), that he could try doing things in smaller blocks and save his work to create the finished product....or that he may have a virus/trojan and should run an anti virus program.....

Does that deter me from getting a Mac? No it does not....what's more off-putting is the snobbery and fanboyism that's prevelant within the Mac community, something that's fostered, nurtured even, by the advertising mentality, elitist prices and Steve Jobs' smug attitude....

Heaven forbid that when I actually own one, a zealots soap box sprouts beneath my feet and I start bumping my gums with fanboy-speak. If that happens I'll have to sell it!

INTEL G5

Dammt lolapola, how many times do we tell you to not just start typing stuff when it isn't valid?! What you just wrote made you look incredibly stupid. Intel does not make the G5 processor, IBM and Motorola do. The Intel PowerMac will be called the Mac Pro, feature a Dual-Core Conroe (Intel Core Duo 2) or Dual-Dual-Core Conroes (4 cores).

See, I'm at least somewhat intelligent.

sorry, but right now there sticking with g5,im sorry to tell u! and i know it from a good source, oh and i said that the graph work goes better on a mac,and RENDERING, is better on a mac, just go to disney/pixar and see what computers they use to animate. Oh and like i said, mac has kernel panics when u load more than ur specs can handle!
oh and the powerbook is somhow old,ppl with mac had to wait to get into a desktop mac to make heavy work cus as u stated, g4 was like an intel PIII,sloooow old and sluggish,another factor on making a dvd (specially using idvd software) is the coding, one slight mistake on the menu (for instance not converting audio to aac) will make idvd impossible to open the file, even though u saw it with the music when u first did it, common issue, use google or go to www.macosx.com and meowy, i heard bout macbook 3 moths before launch, and mini, and MBP,never heard of mac pro as the substitute of powemac, it will be intel's twin version, but g5 will stick in, in fact, only quad stays and will remain as the top of the line system, im not sure, but then why do they keep doing things in universal binary, why not then do what the did to os9, emulate osx software...cus g5 is staying!

Indeed, the Intel Conroe (current codename of the desktop chip) has already been manufactured with four cores on the die.

They (Intel) have indicated that the first release will have two cores on the die, and future releases will most likely have four cores.

There are other codenames (I did not bookmark the article) for the notebook and server chips from this next generation family of chips from Intel.

I do know that the desktop and notebook chips support power management similar to the speed stepping capabilities of the Pentium "M" chips, which are widely considered Intel's best chip to date when considering work load to power use (and heat) ratio.

It should be exciting for both the PC and Mac platform when these are released, especially if they get the four core (true quad) released with good power management and heat dissipation.